A Lack of useful Information

“Household bleach to be used as a spray for disinfection: I strongly recommend against that,” warns Dr. Klaus L.E. Kaiser. “Its highly caustic properties can easily cause painful burns on the skin, respiratory problems, and blindness in eyes.”
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A Lack of useful Information

Dr. Klaus L.E. Kaiser

It really upsets me when I hear on radio or see on TV newscasts some groups of people dutifully “disinfecting” whole streets by spraying them with “disinfectants” of one kind or another.

Of course, washing hands is always a good first step. And the health authorities’ advice in that regard is certainly good, like the information at Canada’s website shown nearby.

Fundamental difference between “Cleansing” and “Disinfection”

This Government of Canada website (accessed on March 13, 2020, 2150 EDT), provides only one basic advice, namely thorough handwashing.

There’s nothing wrong with that advice per se, but is not an advice on “disinfection” of any surface that may harbor the corona or another type of virus.

There is a fundamental difference between “Cleansing” and “Disinfection”

A “cleansing agent”, such as ordinary soap, dish-washer detergent, and the like needs some additional “action” to do their Job. Rubbing your hands with the soap, using several stages of wash and rinse cycles in the dishwasher, or wiping the counter with a cloth are such actions. However, none of those are truly “100% disinfecting.”

However, for organisms like viruses, that can survive for days on all kinds of surfaces other than skin, that ”cleansing” alone, obviously, is insufficient to stop the spread of such organisms. For example, the COVID-19 virus has been claimed to be able to survive on metal and plastic surfaces for up to 72 hours. Other data suggest this survival time to be much lower. It likely depends very much on the air humidity, temperature, surface properties and so on.

If one wants to “disinfect” a surface, as opposed to “cleansing” it, one needs a more rigorous method, .i.e. the application of disinfectant.

Disinfection

If it’s so simple to “disinfect”, i.e. to destroy bacteria and viruses, why do our governments not state—publicly, in newspaper, radio, and TV ads—what to use, where, when, and how for all citizens to know?

HOW and WITH WHAT MATERIAL does one best disinfect, at home, in schools, and anywhere what can easily be disinfected? I have not seen any advice from my government sources. There is none to be had. For example, a simple search on Google for “government Canada disinfection advisory 2020” provides only limited information on materials to be useful for disinfection.

I consider this as a severe lack of readily available, practical and useful information for the population at large, actually as a sad “case.”

True Disinfection

Commercial “disinfectants” are widely available in many stores. They often go with fanciful names and (claimed) attributes. But not all such products (some coming in a large number of variations) are real disinfectants.

True disinfection requires the use of a material that actually KILLS the germs, preferably on the spot.

One of the best, fast acting and widely available materials at low cost is (more or less) absolute “ethyl alcohol” also known as ethanol or simply “alcohol.”  That’s stuff is commonly available in drug stores at 75% or higher concentration. It quickly destroys any live tissue or organism by one simple mechanism, namely by dehydration. That process kills the organisms very quickly and efficiently.

Make sure to carefully read the labels on such things, if it doesn’t say 70% ethanol or so, it’s probably not what you want to use for effective disinfection.
Yes, that ethyl alcohol is the same stuff you may drink in beer, wine, or other alcoholic drink, except at much lower concentrations.

And, just in case of an emergency and you can’t find any ethanol anywhere, common “rubbing alcohol,” a slightly different “chemical” (isopropanol, or 2-propanol) that is widely available as a 70% solution,  would almost be as good a disinfectant as high-grade ethanol. In fact, a very similar concoction to rubbing alcohol is widely used in Germany under the trade name Sterillium. It is certainly not to be consumed, even if diluted.

To paraphrase Paracelsus (1493-1541), slightly expanded here, “it’s not just the dose but also the concentration that makes the poison.”

And a Cautionary Note

The CTV TV aired this evening (March 23, 2020) a full hour interview with Dr. A. Sharkawy (Univ. Toronto) in which he recommended a dilute solution of common household bleach to be used as a spray for disinfection. I strongly recommend against that. Its highly caustic properties can easily cause painful burns on the skin, respiratory problems, and blindness in eyes.

__________________________

Dr Klaus L E KaiserDr. Klaus L.E. Kaiser is a professional scientist with a Ph.D. in chemistry from the Technical University, Munich, Germany. He has worked as a research scientist and project chief at Environment Canada‘s Canada Centre for Inland Waters for over 30 years and is currently Director of Research at TerraBase Inc. He is author of nearly 300 publications in scientific journals, government and agency reports, books, computer programs, trade magazines, and newspaper articles.

Dr. Kaiser has been president of the International Association for Great Lakes Research, a peer reviewer of numerous scientific papers for several journals, Editor-in-Chief of the Water Quality Research Journal of Canada for nearly a decade, and an adjunct professor. He has contributed to a variety of scientific projects and reports and has made many presentations at national and international conferences.

Dr. Kaiser is author of CONVENIENT MYTHS, the green revolution – perceptions, politics, and facts
convenientmyths.com

Dr. Kaiser can be reached at: mail@convenientmyths.com


32 thoughts on “A Lack of useful Information”

  1. Dr. Kaiser,

    Normally I would rip you a new one over this bit considering a couple here in Arizona recently ingested a fish tank cleaner because in contained chloroquine, this is probably sage advise as people no longer have any common sense.

  2. “A Lack of useful Information” – that’s for sure…

    Dr. Klaus L.E. Kaiser is a professional scientist with a Ph.D. in chemistry from the Technical University, Munich, Germany

    “for organisms like viruses, that can survive for days on all kinds of surfaces”

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organism

    a virus not an organism

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organism

    search: virus not an organism

    search: virus in universe

    Unlike “Brawndo” in “Idiocracy” viruses don’t got enzymes.

    Although viruses have a few enzymes and molecules characteristic of living organisms, they have no metabolism of their own; they cannot synthesize and organize the organic compounds from which they are formed.

    Coronae Glandis Virus is not the problem – Medical Martial Law and the ongoing cull to cover up and mitigate food shortages during GSM is the problem.

  3. Almost all the stocks of hand disinfectants in Australia have gone through panic buying.

    In the absence of alternatives Methylated alcohol – mostly ethyl alcohol with added methyl alcohol to render the combination undrinkable to protect the “booze” industry – is probably the cheapest disinfection agent usually readily available.

  4. “The microbe is nothing. The terrain is everything.” Louis Pasteur (1822-1895) is purported to have made this statement on his deathbed. The origin of the quote is attributed to Claude Bernard (1813-1878), a physiologist and contemporary of Pasteur. By quoting Bernard, Pasteur was recanting his germ theory, a theory that assigned the cause of disease to microbes invading and reeking havoc on the body, with specific germs causing specific diseases.

    In contrast to Pasteur, Claude Bernard and Antoine Bechamp (1816-1908), another contemporary of Pasteur, believed disease was a condition of imbalance in the internal terrain of body. Bernard and Bechamp emphasized the context or environment in which germs lived and not the germs. On the one hand, if the terrain was balanced (homeostatic), then germs could not flourish. On the other hand, if the terrain were out of balance, then germs would thrive. In short, germs do not cause disease. Instead, they are a sign of the diseased conditions of the terrain and not the cause of those conditions (see Stockton, 2000).

    The August, 2012, issue of Health and Wellness Monthly, explores the principle that the “terrain is everything” with the intention of emphasizing the importance and usefulness of adopting a naturalistic approach to health and wellness.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrain_theory (wiki is 50% psyop – you have to figure it out – intellect recognizes intellect)

    The terrain theory is the theory of disease proposed by Antoine Béchamp that a diseased body, the “terrain”, will attract germs to come as scavengers of the weakened or poorly defended tissue. Béchamp believed that the pH of the body is important, and that an acidic pH will attract germs and an alkaline pH will repel them.

    In modern science, germ theory as developed by Louis Pasteur has been the scientific consensus for many years. Germ theory states that microorganisms, bacteria, virus and fungi, are the cause of most diseases. It is the cornerstone of modern medicine and treatment of disease, while Terrain Theory is now medically obsolete.[1] – like fuck it is!… Understand vitamin D3

  5. Japan, 3/24 (Tue)
    7-centimeter snowfall in Yamagata. Return to winter.
    Turning from the weather in the spring, the snow in Yamagata Prefecture has fallen all over, and the weather has returned to winter.
    In the prefecture on April 24, the temperature dropped due to the cold air flowing into the sky, and the entire area became snow. The snow began to fall late on the night of the 23rd, and the snowfall for 12 hours until 10 am on the 24th was 14 cm in Hijiori, Okuramura, 12 cm in Shinjo, 11 cm in Kanayama, and 7 cm in Yamagata. It is the first time in 18 days since March 6 that we have observed more than 1 cm of snowfall in Yamagata.
    The lowest temperature was 3.8 ° C below Oizawa in Nishikawa Town, 2.9 ° C below Hijiori in Okura Village, 2.9 ° C below Higashiori, and 2.3 ° C below Higashi. It is expected that the weather will gradually recover on the 25th, after which the maximum temperature will rise above 10 ° C and return to the spring weather.
    https://headlines.yahoo.co.jp/hl?a=20200324-00010000-sakuranbo-l06

  6. Serbia: Up to 5 cm of snow on roads in Vranje
    By RTV March 24, 2020
    Roads of Serbia are informing the public that in some places snow is up to 5 centimeters in the first, second and third priority routes on the territory of Vranje. Cautious driving is recommended, and due to the announced low temperatures, there is a possibility of fog and occasional freezing on the roads, especially in stretches along river streams, valleys, gorges as well as on road objects across rivers. JP Roads of Serbia urges drivers to adjust their speed to the conditions of the road and advises maximum caution when driving.
    http://www.rtv-vranje.rs/index.php/home/drus-v/item/23550-do-5-centimetara-snega-na-putnim-pravcima-na-teritoriji-vranja.html

  7. I helped write the protocol for HIV in the state of Tn in the mid eighties. A 10% solution of unscented Clorox will also kill
    the Coronavirus. Dr Jack Bailey

  8. There is a good reason bleach is not sold in metal containers…
    Bought a 20 year old house trailer. The siding was greenish and the wood and cement stones were black with mold. Had to use straight bleach four to five times and it did a fantastic job. The staining stuck very well too and did not peal.
    Noticed that the Aluminum roof ran a bit but was fine as was washing it off.

  9. I don’t remember the specifics but using bleach to disinfect the home was pretty much also the recommendation during the early stages of the AIDS epidemic. (I shared a house for a time with one of my relatives who was HIV positive and his former partner who had AIDS). My recollection is that we didn’t “spray” bleach but used bleach on a cloth to wipe surfaces (especially kitchen and bathroom) after use… and also added bleach to all laundry.

    My impression at this point is that using cleaning wipes with bleach should suffice for cleaning surfaces and adding bleach to all wash is still a good idea (I do that whenever I’m sick, and separately clean any wash contaminated with any kind of body fluids with bleach added to detergent – then clean those items a 2nd time with the rest of the laundry with just detergent.

  10. Since I mentioned using bleach to disinfect earlier, I need to add this info – NEVER use bleach with any cleaning product containing ammonia, since that will produce toxic fumes (which have killed people).

    I also checked my bottle of bleach, it says right on it that for kitchen or household use mix 3/4 cup with 1 gallon of water. That can then be used for example, with a wet cloth or mop to clean floors or other surfaces. To be on the safe side, if I smell bleach I always open windows until that smell is gone.

  11. Please don’t inform too much which medication is useful against corona as I already read that people passed away caused by taking medicaments against corona prescribed on internet. I also heard this morning that in Italy, Lombardy, some unknown pneumonia was already there for some time. Hence the presented statistics at internet, also sience institutes gave that misinformation, only showed percentiles and failed to give an interpretation under what circumstances these numbers were gatherd together. and how to interprete numbers. That is veruseful for journalists as they usually fail to understand numbers, but not rumor. A flaw, to say the least. Scientists were using the normal-distribution to persuade not to inform and politicians were in this way trapped by their institutes. They shoot themselves in their feet, left and right one. Now the mess is turned into an economically one. Arrogancy has his own price. We are humans, hence we like mess. It is just like by climate change. Numbers are difficult to understand as numbers represent ideas.

  12. People buy bleach every day and lots of people have pools. Sure, there are accidents with any hazardous liquid or poison. But to insinuate all people are ignorant is to be ignorant to the fact that the population actually knows how to use bleach safely is a bit pompous and condescending. And to think we will drink rubbing alcohol or rub bleach or alcohol in our eyes ! Oh! The humanity! Maybe shouldn ‘t allow them to pump their own gas either!You despicable deplorables and Wal mart shoppers you better not rub soap in your eyes either! Omygawd! What about OVEN CLEANER or HYDROGEN PEROXIDE! Batteries have acid in them ! How bot banning all of it? I just hope there are enough hospital beds! I know, lets call congress to make them sign Pelosis bill so we can read it! Then we will know if it builds enough hospitals to save us all from ourselves! Thats the ticket!

  13. Aptly titled lacking useful information.

    DILUTE bleach water is one of the most widely, and safely, used surface disinfectants. At about 1:10 or 1:16 ratio of household bleach to water. No, it did not damage me.

    https://www.aphis.usda.gov/animal_health/emergency_management/downloads/epa-approval-sodium-hypochlorite.pdf

    https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/community/organizations/cleaning-disinfection.html

    For disinfection, diluted household bleach solutions, alcohol solutions with at least 70% alcohol, and most common EPA-registered household disinfectants should be effective.
    Diluted household bleach solutions can be used if appropriate for the surface. Follow manufacturer’s instructions for application and proper ventilation. Check to ensure the product is not past its expiration date. Never mix household bleach with ammonia or any other cleanser. Unexpired household bleach will be effective against coronaviruses when properly diluted.
    Prepare a bleach solution by mixing:
    5 tablespoons (1/3rd cup) bleach per gallon of water or
    4 teaspoons bleach per quart of water

    Also, soap does not just mechanically wash virus from a surface. It disrupts the membrane inactivating the virus.

    https://www.newsweek.com/this-why-soap-so-effective-stopping-spread-coronavirus-1491203

    Soap wipes out viruses including SARS-CoV-2—the pathogen which causes the disease COVID-19 not to be confused with the SARS virus—because it is able to dissolve its fat membrane, explained Palli Thordarson, a chemistry professor at the University of New South Wales.

    The 2 best, widely available, suface treatments for corona virus are dilute bleach water and hot soapy water. Both destroy the virus and both are safe properly used.

    Yes, straight bleach can be damaging and must be treated with respect, but any housewife or househusband already knows that.

    I’ve bleach water mopped floors and cleaned counter tops (family restaurant) since 1960 without personal injury. From a grammar school age, so even a kid can handle it.

  14. 100ml bleach in 1litre water as a spray for car doors doorknobs and letterboxes etc wouldnt hurt
    inside?
    best not it would be breathing hazard as a fine mist, most housewives know it already;-)
    as well as mildly bleaching what fabrics it hit too.
    methylated spirits or 30% cleaning vinegar might be useful
    just DONT light a match for a while
    dettol/phenol iodine etc
    theres a lot of options
    choose wisely

  15. It is safe to use bleach with laundry soap if you wish to scrub and disinfect something at the same time. Because laundry soal is designed to work with bleach.

    Ran myself out of the house once by putting bleach in my dish water. It is not compatible with dish soap. So if you must do mold experiments in your frig, wash dishes first, then soak them in bleach water. Or vice versa.

  16. I made my own disinfectant spray by putting
    half cup of white vinegar, half cup of rubbing alcohol with one cup of water. It’s strong so I always wear rubber gloves when cleaning with it. I’m amazed at how it gets my kitchen and bathrooms so sparkling clean!

  17. By the way the therapeutic dose of chloroquine is 300-500 mg once a WEEK. Those people taking fish tank cleaner? WTF?

    “Only 2 things are infinite. The universe and human stupidity and I’m not sure about the former.” – Albert Einstein

  18. To my valued Readers, in response to some of your comments, simply in order of time stamps:
    @ Mike Fletcher ( March 24, 2020 at 12:35 pm):
    I think your comment about “chloroquine” (an anti-malaria compound) is not relevant here.

    @ Rocket Scientist (March 24, 2020 at 12:46 pm
    OK, as written (e.g., https://www.biologyonline.com/dictionary/organism ), even the biologists don’t seem to agree on whether a virus is “alive.” Suffice to say, IMHO, anything that’s able to replicate itself is “alive.” (And if they were “dead”, what’s the worry anyway?).

    @ Rosco (March 24, 2020 at 12:51 pm)
    Agree, wholeheartedly.

    @ Rocket Scientist (March 24, 2020 at 12:58 pm)
    Your quote “Germ theory states that microorganisms, bacteria, virus and fungi, are the cause of most diseases” is probably correct.

    @ Dr Jack Bailey (March 24, 2020 at 1:43 pm)
    You state: “A 10% solution of unscented Clorox will also kill the Coronavirus.”
    This may well be true, depending on (i) the kind of “Clorox” and (ii) the time of exposure.

    In fact, I clearly state that household bleach (i.e.“Clorox”) is a good disinfectant – provided you have plenty of water at hand to clean off its residues. BTW, for many years, Clorox was only available as a 5% solution of sodium hypochlorite. In recent years is has also been market in a concentrated form with 8% or higher.

    @ wise juan (March 25, 2020 at 5:21 am)
    Thank you for your accolade!

    @ E.M.Smith (March 25, 2020 at 5:27 am)
    You iterate what I’ve been saying: “Diluted household bleach solutions can be used if appropriate for the surface.” Is your skin or are your eyes such “appropriate surfaces?”
    Soap and detergents are surface-active materials that help to “solubilize” things on a solid surface so that they can be wiped off. That’s exactly my point, moving such “organisms” around does not (necessarily) kill them.

    @ laurel (March 25, 2020 at 5:33 am)
    Exactly my point: “Bleach” (undiluted) can disinfect but also cause severe problems when on the skin or getting into the eyes. When it comes to DILUTED bleach (e.g. 10:1) the effectiveness as active agent is diminished. Then it takes much longer time and even then it may not achieve the desired effect.

    In conclusion, let me reiterate:
    Best DISINFECTION is achieved by exposure to 70(+)% “alcohol” (ethanol or isopropanol). Furthermore, neither will corrode (nor “bleach” your skin).

    • @ Rocket Scientist (March 24, 2020 at 12:58 pm)
      Your quote “Germ theory states that microorganisms, bacteria, virus and fungi, are the cause of most diseases” is probably correct. (it’s not my quote – it’s the wiki disinfo quote)

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrain_theory (wiki is 50% psyop – you have to figure it out – intellect recognizes intellect)

      it’s not my quote – it’s the wiki disinfo quote intentionally promoting “germ theory’ and misdirecting the herd to go chemical instead of maintaining the terrain like cows and most higher life forms. Idiots use chemicals to try to fix nature. Intellect recognizes intellect… and nature is billions of years of intellect by natural selection. Kids raised in hyper clean “chemically disinfected” environments have the most disease. Kids with the most detergents and metals and viruses and bio crap injected into their blood streams have the most disease and lowered immunity.

      Martinus W. Beijerinck
      …who founded the discipline of virology with his discovery of viruses. Beijerinck was the first to recognize that viruses are reproducing entities that are different from other organisms.
      A virus “crystal” consists of several thousand viruses and, because of its purity, is well suited for chemical studies.
      Mechanisms of growth for protein and virus crystals.
      Crystal Structures of Influenza A Virus Matrix Protein M1: Variations on a Theme

      mold fungus yeasts bacteria are what turn the dead and dying meat and plant material back into compost, cancer is a fungus. You have all of the above “organisms” and crystal viruses in your gut and blood stream at all times, enough to turn you back to dust without a fly laying eggs on you and letting the maggots have a nice go too – viruses may be like the 0.05 micron sized plasma crystaline crap of the above parasites or just the spawn of the viruses themselves (A virus is a sub-microscopic “infectious” (in a low immune system) agent that replicates only inside the living cells of an organism.) that permeate the universe – like in outer space. The immune system (good gut bacteria) not hygeine is what keeps the composters in check. When the immune sytem fails the meat is like unradiate lettuce left out on the counter top – there is “stuff” in there ready to turn it back to dirt.
      https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/83913/the-probiotics-revolution-by-gary-b-huffnagle-phd-with-sarah-wernick/

      Klaus it’s obvious that most human brains are made of meat and that’s likely the main reason that the alien androids won’t contact us;)
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnFSqVfNrXY

      Stop putting chemicals on and in your meat. As above nutirition includes D3.
      https://vitamindwiki.com/VitaminDWiki

      • Klaus, like Jean S., is likely the result of too much required reading. Why does it take a crazy rationalwiki architect to write Not by Fire and Mag/Rev instead of a geologist or geophysicist – because they still believe that oil is a fossil fuel no matter how much evidence of abiotic oil is presented. Hygiene and germ theory is a religion.

        MIC – medical/military industrial complex

        • Well, personally I do believe in the abiotic oil theory (despite getting my MS in geography from a department of geology & geography..

          OK, I had to put up with “Hygiene” jokes for years (as opposed to “hi Jean”). I also was raised by a mom who believed in DIRT and that dirt exposure for us kids was a good way to get your immune system working properly… so as kids myself and my brothers did not take a bath or shower daily, only 1 x a week (or none if we had gone swimming). And I know that some diseases, like polio became more serious problems due to excessive hygiene. (Polio shots didn’t come out until I was 5, and I remember all the parents in my hometown freaking out about it and that long, long line to get my first polio shot).

  19. I hear the odd joke that vodka can be useful to sanitise things.
    Not true. The hand sanitiser is about 85% alcohol. Breweries have stopped making beer in order to make sanitiser instead.
    Kudos to them and I think I have enough soap, toilet roll and noodles. However, I have not stocked up on whisky. I believe the alcohol has more important purposes right now.
    Cheers!

  20. Another thing I like to have in my emergency kit is SALT. The reason being – many (but not all) microorganisms are salt sensitive and salt will kill them. It may be more bacteria than viruses (which is why salting food for storage works)… but salt is still something good to have in your “stash”. You would need to look it up to make sure a specific microbe is salt sensitive, but in general I like to use a saline solution to clean off wounds, especially f you have no other options.

    When we were kids at the beach that’s one thing my mother reminded us about, and you can tell seawater helps heal a lot of small cuts.

  21. Methylated Spirits is pretty close to 96% ethanol. It just has an additive which makes it smell not so nice and taste bad. If you can’t get anything else you could use that!

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